How Discount Tours in Morocco End Up Costing You 3X More (Or Worse)

[00:00:00] Welcome back to another incredible episode of Destination Morocco podcast. This is part two of dangerous scams to avoid in Morocco. we did part one, so this is part number two. And in this part, we're going to specifically talk about. some confusion in terms of the description and also some scams that are really, really common and they're very hard to detect in Morocco, especially if you, you know, first time visiting solo [00:01:00] travel, female travel and stuff like that.

AZDEAN: So, and this, this is regarding the unprofessional and unofficial tour companies, travel agencies and the transportation companies. and also what it means to be a tour operator versus transportation company versus a travel agency offering group tours.

So Siham, we're going to start with you first. This is, this is a very touchy subject. personally, it had affected our business and it still does, and I'm sure you're in the same boat as well. And mainly the reason is because of prices and also because these type of things in Morocco, especially in Marrakech, are really, really not regulated.

by the authorities. So, Siham, if you would please give us some examples, in terms of the population of These, services and the areas where they are found, please.

Yeah.

SIHAM: Okay, thank you so much. So yeah, as you said, Azdean, this is a very common problem that [00:02:00] tourists will get. It's just getting so confused with many agencies around different things. prices and they never know what is the right thing, right? So, everybody visited Marrakech and walking around the Medina, especially the oldest part of the city, we're gonna notice that numerous agencies, how they call themselves, travel company, travel agency daily excursions different names, it's just so many, like in each street, in each single street of Marrakech, you're gonna find like three or four.

They are even more than the stores, the grocery stores in each street, which is like, a bit weird. Like, the question is Who is official? And how can we make a difference? Why everything looks like the same while the [00:03:00] costs are quite different? And again, if we will compare all of them with, a real official travel agency. Why is it like so huge?

AZDEAN: Yes. Yeah. The gap is huge.

SIHAM: Yes. So it's really affecting the work that someone do it by heart is doing to making sure, of getting the best services. For our visitors and the highest quality in terms of accommodations, restaurants, transportation and so on.

So, the first thing that we're going to notice is that many of them are around, each has just a small store, sometimes of one or two meters square,

AZDEAN: Oh, wow. 

SIHAM: very small. Some of them don't even have a store. No office. Some of them has just a sign. They are just standing in the street,

AZDEAN: Yeah. I've seen them in, in, in the [00:04:00] square. Yeah. Yeah. You'll see the big sign, then they're standing next to it and offering you excursions. Yeah.

SIHAM: And in some few restaurants, especially around the square, they are renting in front of the restaurant to those guys to put their signs. So, yeah, the office is the entry to that restaurant. He's getting a chair right there and the sign next to him with some few pictures of Morocco and start calling the people that walking around.

Okay,

AZDEAN: foot traffic. Yeah, 

SIHAM: Yeah, excursions and calling, you know, like very unprofessional. The cost never, like clear. You don't have anything official. You don't have anything official, even a name. So All the thing is just offering you a very, very cheap excursions, day trips,

activities, or sometimes even tours.

Here especially I'm going to specify [00:05:00] and talk about the three days, famous three days Sahara, tour.

AZDEAN: Yes. Yeah. 

SIHAM: Because this is, yes, from Marrakech, yeah, always from Marrakech. It's so funny, because you're gonna sometimes, Get the offer of a $50 tour to the desert, which is for three days.

AZDEAN: So, so 50 for the three days.

SIHAM: For the three days, including Accommodations for two nights, breakfast for two nights, dinner for two nights, a camel ride in the desert as well. And transportation. Unbelievable.

Unbelievable. 

AZDEAN: for sure.

SIHAM: So, there we have to think. Just stop. Oh, think about it. it's so good. So this trip the least if you're getting like quite medium accommodations It's going to be at least $700 or 800 per person, right? So that's a huge [00:06:00] difference.

AZDEAN: So how, how, how are they able to offer those rates? This is number one. And have you been in one of those tours or excursions, three day or four day from Marrakech to, to Merzouga or to, to the desert? And if you can share that experience with the audience, please.

SIHAM: Yeah, sure. So, it happens to me that a couple of times, few of my clients asked me about the program and budget for a Sahara tour. I was providing it and then I heard from them that they found it much and quite cheaper. Around the square, and then I was asking like how much that was. So I started to hear, I mean, I'm talking about four, at least four years ago when it just started.

Now it's, it's even getting worse now. There are more like maybe six times more than four years ago. It means it's working now.

AZDEAN: Yeah.

SIHAM: So, yeah, I was curious. If [00:07:00] I remember, it was like three years ago. I was curious to know. How they manage that trips, like with that cost, you know, it's, it's unbelievable.

So I decided to go for a trip to book a trip and go.

AZDEAN: Through those, those people.

SIHAM: yes, with the group. Okay. So, of course, as I said, the cost is going to be a $50, 60, 70. That's, that's the average. So, very fast, I started to notice the stopping in each time in several places. Most of them like restaurants or bazaars that sells things and all the way.

AZDEAN: So is there a reason why they stop our restaurants and bazaars and stuff like that?

SIHAM: Yeah, if it's if it's a mealtime There were there were a lot of breaks sometimes just would anyone use the toilet? cafe When we get there and I was asking about the cost the toilet was always [00:08:00] costing money even you get in a coffee and it's always more than it must be, like two or three times. The coffee, the same thing.

So everything was overpriced. The same for buying any things like a scarf or even a stone as a souvenir. Everything was, was costing quite more than must be. Same for restaurants. 

AZDEAN: because when you say higher price, higher this, higher that, the next follow up question that I have, is it because they're getting commission?

SIHAM: that definitely sure.

AZDEAN: Okay, so they can sell tours at really, really ridiculously cheap prices because they know they're going to get a commission out of this gas station to use the restrooms, they're going to get a commission out of this coffee shop because they're going to stop, maybe a group, I don't know how many people in the group, they're going to buy some coffee, whatever they They're overcharged because that coffee shop has to pay commission to whoever is bringing that group to them.

So now it's, now it's, [00:09:00] they're not spending 50 bucks. They're not spending 60 bucks. Now they're spending more, but they don't know it.

SIHAM: yes, if anyone counted how much money would spent on that tour, it's going to definitely be more than a $700,

dollars that a regular agency is going to ask for, that definitely more in a horrible way. Why I say horrible? Because you're losing money in someone else's commissions. And the services you're getting is just the worst service.

AZDEAN: Wow.

SIHAM: If we're talking about restaurants, so these people are taking you to the cheapest and the worst restaurants where you get, the food, which is sometimes causing stomach problems and food poisoning. For travelers, they're often coming back with those problems. They don't care about Any of these things, you know, or what they, care about.

It's getting commissions through those places because the guests [00:10:00] are going to pay three or four times more than the normal cost for a meal. It's in the middle of nowhere. They don't have even an

AZDEAN: Exactly. Yes. And just to add to what you said, Siham, the menu switch is one of the common scams and we talked about it last time when we did the live Q&A with Ted, imagine yourself in the middle of nowhere. You know, I'm a local, I'm going to pay $70.

You're a foreigner, you're a tourist, you're a traveler. You're going to pay $240. You

SIHAM: Yes. This, I had also during, sorry, during that, that trip, I was

AZDEAN: you witnessed it.

SIHAM: Yes. Yes, because when I wanted to pay, the guy told me this, told me, oh, that the cost was for the tourists, you're going to pay only that,

AZDEAN: Hmm. Wow.

SIHAM: okay? So it was clear that the cost weren't the same for everyone. let's talk also about the hotels used for those trips. we're talking about group trips. If you're paying that money, you're going to get, [00:11:00] minibus, like a van of at least a 17 to 20 seats. Okay.

AZDEAN: Yeah.

SIHAM: not a car. So in terms of comfort, it's the worst.

AZDEAN: Okay.

SIHAM: talking about a Sahara desert tour, It means you're crossing the high Atlas mountains range. This is not an easy way.

AZDEAN: So just to give the listeners a perspective, an idea of when we talk about traveling from Marrakech through the Atlas Mountains, through Tishka, which is one of the, I think it's the second worst. 

pass in, in Morocco, it's really, really dangerous. Now they have expanded it. They, they, they made, and the

SIHAM: situation is better, but, but, but the, the, the natural, of the place, it's still, it's high, it's narrow, it's, you know, it's curves. So, even in a comfortable car with a good professional driver, it's still a little hard.

AZDEAN: Yes. Yeah.

SIHAM: So, you imagine if taking that road with a van or with many people [00:12:00] and drivers, most of them are not even nice, almost of them don't speak any languages.

That's the first thing that people get shocked with. It's the language. Stopping in a restaurant or a store. So he stops. Rude, open the door, the guests never know what they, what they have to do. If they understood it's to eat or to go to the toilet, for example, they don't know what the average time, what, what should they do, you know,

AZDEAN: yeah, I got you. I got you. So,

SIHAM: everything is confusing.

AZDEAN: so basically, if somebody doesn't speak the language, it's, it's very convenient for them because they don't have to explain the reasoning behind the stops, the reasoning because of the bad service, the reasoning of the commission. Or the, the high prices, they don't have to justify anything.

You look at the driver and say, Hey he doesn't speak in English. There's nothing you can do. So, all you have to do, just go with the experience and, and, [00:13:00] and, and be patient, hopefully. So the drive. a nutshell between Marrakech and Merzouga, it's about 10 hours.

So if you do in three days, it's, if somebody tells you three days, four days, that's a red flag in itself. So, you know, 10 hours back, that's two days without the stop. So you keep in mind, you know, the stops, what are you going to stop? There's nothing for you to see if the drive is 10 hours. So day one is gone, day two is gone.

It's just a, you know, you get, you get to Merzouga and you come back. That's, that's all you really

SIHAM: Merzouga, it was, it was, it was a total of five hours.

AZDEAN: Okay.

SIHAM: It was the night I was supposed to sleep.

AZDEAN: so the question that I have next, Siham, when you said the group we have been in those vehicles, the vehicle that he mentioned in Morocco, they call the minibus in the U S they are called. sprinters, and a lot of them are Mercedes sprinters, but don't be fooled with the logo.

There's, it has nothing to do with whatever you see in the U. S. I'm just talking about the U. S. [00:14:00] market. I'm not familiar with any other market, but I'm, I'm talking about the U. S. market. So the sprinters in the U. S. they are very comfortable, very nice, luxurious, but in Morocco, last summer we did a little bit of study, me and Sam, we did quite a bit of study when it came to, to these vehicles.

And we realized that all the sprinters in Morocco, they are built on a chassis that it's not really for a sprinter, but it's a truck. it doesn't have independent suspension. So which means if you're sitting in the back, especially if sitting on top of those wheels in the back, you're going to feel every bump.

You're going to feel every, pothole.

SIHAM: uncomfortable, really uncomfortable.

AZDEAN: So when you say the group, you know, when you go and somebody tells you 50, 60, 70 bucks for a Merzouga trip for three days to yourself, you're thinking, Oh, wow. Transportation is included. Car and driver is included. Breakfast is included.

This is included. You'll automatically think. That the room is always, it's also included, then you're going to be in a really, really nice, at least a premium camp in Merzouga, if not [00:15:00] luxury, or that's how we think, with your own this, and you know, everything is separate, everything is organized. Can you be a little bit more specific, Siham, and give us those details of people, when you go in those tours, when you go with those trips, when those people, what should you expect?

SIHAM: Well, we already spoke about the conditions, like the car, about the drivers, most of them. And, I have also to mention that a lot of times, and one of them was the time when I was there. we were only halfway in the middle of nowhere. It was July, which was super hot. So some few, clients that were in the back of the van started to ask the driver to turn on the air conditioning in the van. 

AZDEAN: this is like a hundred, a hundred degree Fahrenheit over a hundred degree Fahrenheit inside the vehicle. They're asking for the air conditioning to be turned on. And what did the driver say? [00:16:00] 10

SIHAM: He said that the cost that they paid include the transportation and that the petrol is getting more expensive. And if he turns the air conditioning on, it's going to cost more. So there is an extra charge turn it on. That was like a $10. Yeah. It was like a 10, what he asked per person, a $10 per person.

Yeah. There were like 17 people in the van. So it's going to be accounted.

AZDEAN: Yeah. $170. Wow.

SIHAM: Yep.

AZDEAN: That's an, I never heard that one.

SIHAM: and then for sure being in that van with that heat. You're gonna pay that gonna pay that. I swear

AZDEAN: Yeah. Yeah. A hundred percent. So when you get to the desert, what happens?

SIHAM: Well before getting to the desert the first night supposed to be in the Dades, the famous fortress. Yes, after all the day driving. I mean [00:17:00] passing by Ait Ben Haddou Kasbah, and there, there is a very common, stop scam, another scam too, because, most of the agencies, oh, agencies, I say agencies, they are not real agencies, but all, most of the people that sells those trips they would also say that the guide in Ait Ben Haddou is included.

AZDEAN: I

SIHAM: And then once the van, once the van arrived, there were a guide already waiting in a meeting point. So the driver and that guide know each other, and he knows that he's, arriving at that time. So when the group getting out, they automatically following that, guide, because, of course, in their mind, it's paid.

So his, he took us for the tour. He was, I mean, the explanation, it was very little. getting back, we stopped in a store. I mean, he made us stop on that store. I mean, for him, I was a client, right?

SAM: Yes.

SIHAM: I believe that we [00:18:00] had to buy those scarves.

he called it like the Sahara passport.

AZDEAN: I 

SIHAM: That's something you have to have

AZDEAN: Mm hmm.

SIHAM: to get to the Sahara because it's going to be windy, it's going to be sand and very hot, you have to protect your face and hair. So you buy from this one. It's the last store you will find it in the Sahara. You would regret if you don't have it, whatever it is. So everybody, almost everybody, bought a scarf, which was at least three times more expensive than the normal. So, of course that beside lunch, I, I would say like a thousand percent that that restaurant, of course, giving a big commission to this. Yes. For the lunch, because it was not normal. The food wasn't really good. Ah, and then the first night, we spent it in Dadès. The hotel was quite, quite, quite cheap. Some few members had to share the room with other members. [00:19:00] Some of them weren't happy with that, but they had to do.

AZDEAN: Mm hmm. 

SIHAM: they said like, well, it says that hotels are included, but it did not say it's going to be a private room.

AZDEAN: I see. That

SIHAM: So sometimes it was like seven, eight people in the same room,

AZDEAN: In the same Oh, wow.

SIHAM: Yes, with

AZDEAN: is before, before getting to Merzouga. This is Dadès Valley.

SIHAM: Yes, that's the first night.

AZDEAN: Oh, wow. Seven people in one room.

SIHAM: Yeah, sometimes a four or five depends of the, it's your luck

AZDEAN: So 

SIHAM: And then you, if you wanted to get a private room if you're a couple or something and don't feel comfortable to be with others, then you, they're gonna ask you for paying extra to get a private room and the silly things that Sometimes the room it's more expensive than the tour itself.

AZDEAN: Oh, wow. That's just, that's incredible. Wow. 

SIHAM: that's the first night. The second night, [00:20:00] Oh, even before the night, on the way between Dadès Gorges to Merzouga Gorges, there is another very important stop on a village. Then someone was waiting, as always, a guide. But I forgot to mention that the guide in Ait Benhadou, at the end, he asked for payment.

AZDEAN: Oh, okay. We forgot that. 

SIHAM: Yes.

so some of the group were saying that the guy in the agency said that it was included and then he said no, I work for myself, I don't work for any agency and you please pay me. So, everybody paid the guide. Then the same thing in the Toudra Gorges. The visit to the gorges was very, very, very fast.

Like it was very beautiful, but it was very fast. Just, we have to go. We have to go dot, dot, dot, dot. Again, the group get in and then got back in the van and we drove [00:21:00] like less than a six, seven minutes and then they stopped in a village where a guide was waiting. So he said, Oh, this is the guy he's going to show you around, show you the farms and you're going to be invited for a free tea with a Berber family. walked through some farms there and then we got to a house. It was, for me, not a house. It was a house full of of rugs. That was a

Bazaar.

AZDEAN: Bazaar. 

SIHAM: A bazaar under the title of a local house.

AZDEAN: Berber house or Berber family house.

SIHAM: Yes, that's the title that how they introduce it and they said okay, we can have some free tea here You don't have to pay for we'll come we go in there. It was just full of rugs I mean all the way all the stairs we got upstairs. That was a big room full of rugs. Then suddenly this guy appeared to [00:22:00] explain he explained a little bit about the rugs and the difference and how they make it, how long, how long time they stay. So it was, it was actually quite long and some few, few, I remember a few of the group was wondering why when we have that time, why we didn't spend in the gorges because they liked it, but they had to go.

And now they're just. Wasting that time with their, this is something they didn't even choose. So explanation took like a long time. Then at the end, few of the group bought things, rugs. so I think all the, all the, all the story there, it's not about visiting a Berber family and getting free tea, but it's more to make people buy those rugs.

And I am a hundred percent sure that this guide given also the commission to the driver as well.

AZDEAN: Okay.

SIHAM: So, yeah, this is one thing I don't have to miss. And then back to the desert, [00:23:00] it was about sunset. Everything was stressful.

Everything was stressful. 

AZDEAN: you arrived

SIHAM: Yes, it was late, it was almost sunset, hurry up, hurry up, everything hurry up, and no one explained to you any word about what is coming next.

No one know what to expect. Then some people brought those camels, we were on the camels, then we went to the desert. It was like getting darker already. We arrived at the camp, it was already dark. Then the next story is the camp.

SAM: Yeah.

SIHAM: Ah, the same story of the hotel in Dades, yeah, but even worse because there were like one bathroom for all the camp, no shower after like one and a half an hour come right in the Sahara desert, everybody like needed a shower.

With the sand all over our hair, our ears. Everybody [00:24:00] needs to refresh, but no water.

AZDEAN: Wow.

SIHAM: So the first, after the first two guests that took a shower, there was no more shower.

No water. Water, yes. So everybody was complaining and I was hearing other people complaining about the tent because the agency that sold them the trip promised them a private tent for only themselves and now they have to share with another three people and Then the guy in the camp said like oh, this is what I have I don't have any more if you want I can take you to the camp of the neighbors, but it is Blah, blah, blah, blah, which was like double of the cost of the, yeah, so everything extras, extras, extras.

And the extra, the cheapest extra was the cost of the tour, which is like so silly. And then when you are in the middle of that thing. You don't have a choice, I swear.

SAM: Yes.

SIHAM: You're unhappy [00:25:00] with the food, you'll have to eat it. Otherwise, there is no, even a store, a grocery store, there is nothing.

So you have to eat everything, you have to accept everything.

No explanation, no guide. Just crazy.

AZDEAN: Hmm. So, did anybody think to contact the agency that they booked with, or the guy standing in the middle of the street, or in front of the or

SIHAM: did. Some few ones, they didn't get any reply. Some few ones, someone answered, I said, Oh, I was not the one who saw you this. Maybe it's my colleague. Where is my colleague? There is no colleague. Some of the numbers weren't even working. Some few numbers that they've got, they weren't working

AZDEAN: wow.

SAM: Yeah.

SIHAM: names.

They don't have no names. There is no official booking with any number, with any name. Few of them had the phone numbers. Some few of them weren't working anymore. Some few of them were [00:26:00] just with someone talking about someone that never appeared, you know. So, there were no responsibility. No responsibility.

SAM: Yes.

SIHAM: That was the worst, that was the worst trip I've ever seen. I was feeling so sorry. I was feeling that those people are just destroying the image of Morocco and they're gonna make all these 17 people or more hating that trip to the desert, hating Moroccans, hating the Sahara desert. was so painful to see this.

AZDEAN: it's, I'm going to add something. we, I mean, me and Sam, we go through this all the time. We get emails, we get appointments, we get phone calls. and we have the same thing. Oh, I found this exact same itinerary for this much. First of all, there's no exact same itinerary. It's just impossible unless you do copy paste to one itinerary.

That's, that's the only way that you'll have exact same itinerary. Every tool operator agency or, or a scam. They're all [00:27:00] the same. So, when somebody says that to me, then I try to really, really advise them.

Say, Hey, go look online, do a little bit of research online, look for some reviews, look up the place. basically at the end, we look like we are the bad guys because we're trying to really educate them, trying to prevent something from happening to them. and affecting their experience in, in the worst possible way.

Your story, Siham, unfortunately, it's very common. I have many friends we've heard so many stories. heartbreaking. you travel with a group of 17 people. Now, somebody's sleeping on the floor. Most of them are on the floor, on top of rugs, you know, the desert, you know, you know, July, there's scorpions, there's snakes.

You know, it could be a health hazard, but people, when they think to go to Morocco, they don't think of a lot of this stuff that we think in the back, you know, behind the scene, what's going on. There's, there's challenges. Every tour we have, we are put in fire behind the scene and the guests, the clients, they have no idea and everything looks.

exactly [00:28:00] how they wanted it and even better than they expected it. But we have, because it's just Morocco, it's, there's no system in place. You can have a booking, your booking is confirmed, you get there, there's no booking.

SIHAM: Mm hmm,

AZDEAN: know, it's just so many things. ahead,

SIHAM: very sad because, few, maybe not few, but the majority of tourists, they only care about the cost. They're only looking for good deals. They never think about the quality. I know they care, they think about the quality, but they don't expect or compare the prices or ask even the question, why this product is quite cheaper than this one.

AZDEAN: Yes.

SIHAM: There have just to think about it.

AZDEAN: yeah, it's the way that I see it. again, we are in the same boat. We're in the same industry. And when we get, I mean, we qualify clients as well. And we ask questions and we want to ask the right questions. You know, if you're a price buyer, we're definitely not the ones for you. We sell experiences.

We sell, experiences and memories that you can tell your [00:29:00] grandkids about. And, When they are adults, they'll come and visit Morocco because of the stories that he told them about Morocco. That's the kind of experiences we do. Those are the itineraries we built. If you're looking for cheap, we're not the most expensive.

We're not the cheapest, but we're very fair. Everything that we do is priced the right way. and it's just, it's really unfortunate. And now, nowadays, even with the internet, with the research, with Google, with YouTube, everything, in the tip of our fingers, we still make the wrong decisions.

We still make. The wrong research, if you would. So it, it puts us at really disadvantage. And those, those people, the fake companies or the fake tour operators, or, you know, agencies, they're never going to stop, you know, there are victims coming to them day in and day out, every day. But it's our job again, you know, just going back to what we mentioned.

In the last episode, we're here to bring awareness to, to the travelers, whether they're going to travel with us, whether they're going to travel by themselves or somebody else, so, 

SIHAM: when you get [00:30:00] in or buying those products, it's always not very clear, for example, the details about, okay, accommodations are included, but it's never specifying what types of accommodations or for how many people the rooms are.

Yes. And so it's always missing the small details that after you just like, for example, are you going to get a guide to in this gorges or in this kasbah, but it never says, Oh, that's you need to pay for, right? So, like air conditioning, people don't mention to it, but if someone asked, they would say, yes, it has air conditioning, but they don't say like it's, it has air conditioning with extra fee, you know, it doesn't mention to that.

And of course. Almost of them never give any written proofs. like, that you are booking a trip with them. You don't have any IDs about this agency or a an official name, no, nothing. Some few of them would give you a piece of paper with a date, with the money that you paid, that's all. It doesn't have any official [00:31:00] information that in case anything happened, there is no responsibility, let's say.

So, and then of the stories and lies. The making trips looks like, like the best. You know, you're gonna see this, you're gonna see that, and sometimes it's just go further with, with even completing like lies. talking about a place about things that you will never see. I just remember one time I was just passing by with a friend in front of one of these. I don't know how to call them. He was in the street. They didn't even have an office. He just had like a very big sign with some few pictures. And he was thinking that I was a tourist with my friend and he was inviting us.

And then I just stopped. And then I, I was listening to him trying to sell me these trips. And then he said, and then we organize trip to Aït Benhaddou kasbah. I said, "Oh, that looks nice. Where is that? How far it is? And where is it located?" Then he told me, yeah, Aït [00:32:00] Benhaddou is just in the road between Marrakech and Essaouira so I was like, what?

SAM: my god! Wow,

SIHAM: was a shock. That was a shock. Like, what are you saying? So he didn't even know where that Aït Benhaddou is located. He was just selling. He was just selling.

SAM: yes,

SIHAM: I mean, it's just a very unprofessional and not organized, tours, to whatever day trips to Eureka Valley, the Atlas Mountains, to Essaouira. I mean, you won't imagine a $15 for a full day trip to Issaouira.

AZDEAN: $15?

SIHAM: It's less expensive than a sandwich. It's crazy! What are you talking about?

SAM: what you 

AZDEAN: yeah,

SIHAM: The trip to Essaouira straight away is three hours, [00:33:00] okay? This tour takes at least like four hours to get to Issaouira, because it has several stops, again, to cafes, to restaurants, to argan oil place.

AZDEAN: Yeah.

SIHAM: That's the most, before it was also used to stop at this famous tree full of goats. That, that also was a scam.

So, yeah, it's just crazy. The same, the road to Orica Valley, the Atlas Mountains is same, like all the way like stop, stop, stop, stop. Need to buy this, need to buy that because this is. The real income they are making, they don't care about the

15, $15 you're paying. That's not even the cost for the petrol, for the van.

AZDEAN: Yeah. It makes sense. Okay. I really appreciate your insights, Siham, this is very, very informative. thank you for sharing that information. Now, I know Sam, you've been impatiently waiting for this because I know you you have a lot to say, but before I ask [00:34:00] you any details, any questions, I want to go to the legality of things.

If you would please explain the terminology of the names. We're going to start with transport touristic transport touristic, which is transport. Obviously it's transportation, touristic, tourism, which is very confusing. So in the U S things are a little different, obviously. and some of those names don't exist.

we have transportation, that's what it's called. Transportation, ground transportation. So we don't have. Transportation, Tourism, or any other name. So we'll go, if you can explain to us, what does that mean? Transportouristique? And also, what can a company that is named or labeled Transportouristique do?

And what it cannot do, please? 

SAM: they really want to talk about this, scam. Okay. tourist transportation and we call it touristic transport. Transportation in Morocco is a company that is have an agreement from [00:35:00] the ministry of transportation of Morocco.

And it gives you kind of agreements.

AZDEAN: Okay. So Sam, so I just want to clarify to the audience. So they, they know people, they're familiar with medallions, taxi medallions, limo medallions you know, other medallions in terms of transportation in Morocco is the same. The government gives you a medallion that it's related to your transportation company that that Transportation company.

It's not a public transportation. They cannot pick up the public It's a private but they can only work with travelers. They can only work with tourists.

SAM: Tourists. Absolutely. That's right. then this company, the role, the main role of this company is the transportation of tourists from this area to this area, from

AZDEAN: to point

SAM: to point A to point B. you have like transport them from Marrakech to Essaouira, or from Marrakech to Merzouga, or from Marrakech to the Atlas Mountains or wherever in Morocco, [00:36:00] But the point is they don't have the right. to organize tours or day trips or any other activities in Morocco. It's illegal. If you find a transport, touristic or tourist portage, tourist transportation company that is offering any kind of tours or trips or activities in Morocco, is a scam.

AZDEAN: is not authorized

SAM: It's not. Yes.

AZDEAN: of hotels, in terms of four yards, in terms of restaurants, in terms of, you know,

SAM: Nothing. 

Yes, nothing of that. So their rules is mostly intermediate between the travel agencies, the legal travel agencies, and the legal operators to transport their clients or tourists from point A to point B.

AZDEAN: Okay. So now we're going to, we're going to go to, we talked about Transport Touristic. Now we're going to talk about [00:37:00] tour operators. the difference between tour operators, what is a tour operator in Morocco? What does it mean? Is it tour operator?

Is it a DMC? Is it a, you know, they can, they organize, corporate events. Can they do events? Can they do weddings? what does a tour operator do in Morocco? And how can you get that label or the name of tour operator in Morocco?

SAM: Yes. A tour operator in Morocco is, an agency or a tour operator that can do many, many, many, I mean, many things including incentive. M I C E

and MICE, and what is called, the flights,

AZDEAN: Yeah. Airplane.

SAM: tickets flight tickets, and they can organize, events. They organize weddings, for example, anniversaries and, and so on and so forth.

This, this one, we call it tour operator in Morocco. And they have to have authorizations from the Ministry of Tourism, from the Ministry of, artisans and crafts. In Morocco, there [00:38:00] is two ministries that are giving them authorizations and they give them one for a year, which is, called, provisoire, I don't know,

AZDEAN: Temporary.

SAM: temporary, yeah, sorry, temporary authorization for a year.

And then you have to respect certain rules during this year, or they will take it for you, or they give you one, which is definitive.

AZDEAN: Okay. So let me, so basically what you're saying is before they give you the permanent licenses, they give you a one year probation to make sure that you're operating within the limits of the two ministries. And then when a year passes by, they can make a decision is to give you the final,

SAM: final one.

AZDEAN: or extend your probation to another year.

SAM: No, they, they will, you, you, you have to close forever.

AZDEAN: wow. Okay. Out of business. Okay.

SAM: Yes.

AZDEAN: Okay. This is very important. Thank you for sharing. So now I'm going to talk about the travel agencies, which is the big umbrella, [00:39:00] which can do. everything that we just talked about. but also I want to talk about it in terms of time. How much time does it really take to become a travel agency?

What are the conditions for you to open a travel agency in Morocco? If you would please, Sam, explain that to the audience.

SAM: Yeah, sure. open a travel agency in Morocco, you have first to have a diploma, which is a master degrees in tourism, then you have, you should have a big office. You have to have a meeting room. You have to have certain con conditions.

Then you have to ask for authorizations from like three ministries, including Ministry of Transportation, ministry of Tourism, ministry of Interior. For interior affairs in Morocco or when they approved you, you have to put an amount of money in the bank to block this amount of money forever, during the lifetime of the agency. it depends. [00:40:00] For example, could it be 20 years, a hundred years for example, 200 years? I don't know. It

AZDEAN: what's, what's the amount that need to block

SAM: the amounted debit is $50,000 

AZDEAN: it's like an insurance. It's, it's a money that, that stays in. Okay. Okay. I got you.

SAM: Yes. It's yeah, it's a kind of, of insurance that you have to put it in a special bank. It's not your bank. It's a special bank. Like, Wall Street Bank in the U.

S. It's called Bank Le Maghreb in Morocco. And you have to have a certain kind of insurances. And this is very, very important. This kind of insurance, you have to have it. It's liability insurance. You have to have, like, work accident insurance. I don't know what you call it.

AZDEAN: Yes.

SAM: And then you should have, another insurance that is protecting travelers especially when you are doing like, trekking in the mountains and stuff.

AZDEAN: Yeah.

SAM: Then you can have these [00:41:00] authorizations for a travel agency, also as a tour operator for one year. And then you should have income, certain amount of money, which is, $200, 000 in a year.

AZDEAN: Oh, I see. Okay.

SAM: If you don't do that, so at the end of the year, they will come to a commission from, the capital from Rabat, of course, they come from the ministries and they come to your office together.

And you have to give them, to approve them, this amount of money that you income it from the travelers of the tourists, real tourists in Morocco. Then they will approve you to have like a final license for a travel

AZDEAN: so you get, basically you get audited and if you pass the audit, then you'll get your permanent licensing to operate as a A travel agency, 100%. So the process really, you know, to have a master's degree, that's quite a bit, you know, that's, that's kind of a [00:42:00] harsh really you know, versus the US travel agency.

You just, it's, it's beyond simple and easy. So, you know, even all these difficulties that the system is set up that the government has, there's still almost no system operating in Morocco because there's so many illegal people working. Legal entities, legal companies, And it's really, really unfortunate because again, it affects us.

And unfortunately, again, a lot of tourists pay the price. So in this case, there's a reason why I wanted to ask you to clearly specify, because I know in the U S there's, there's a lot of travel agents. There's a lot of agencies. There's a lot of people in the travel industry, but they don't know the difference.

You know, here you say travel agency. They think it's the same in Morocco. You go in, you get your DBA, you get your LLC, whatever, or you get your, you know, accounting set up. Now you're operating travel agency. You can do it on your own or it can be under a host agency. And it's, it's pretty simple process.

You know, obviously got to do your homework and pick up your niche, whether it's, [00:43:00] you know, river cruise, ocean cruise groups, whatever your niche is. In Morocco, it's very different. you're going to have a master's degree. Then you're going to, you're going to have that. person with that master's degree, being in the company, managing the company, or being with the company for at least a year, for everything to go smooth and everything to get finally approved, by the government.

Now, the thing that we all know that we've seen this literally every day, especially when I, I've, I've been to Merzouga, we've been to the desert, And I look at websites not as much as I used to. I looked at a hundred and a hundred and a hundred of, of a website. And when I see something interesting in a good way, on a bad way, I always call you Sam.

And when I call and say, Hey, look at this. Look at what these people are doing. Well look at this. And, and you look at it and say, oh, I know this guy. This guy is not a travel agency. This guy just, he has a

SAM: many times.

AZDEAN: he works in Merzouga, yeah, it's so

SIHAM: calls himself a travel company, a travel agency, a travel company, a travel Everybody, [00:44:00] like, it's crazy. Sometimes drivers that even don't or doesn't own the car, just driving for someone, just taking a picture in the car or putting on Instagram or on a website and say, Okay, travel company.

And yeah, it's, it's,

SAM: Okay, I want to clarify just something here. There is no travel, something called travel company in Morocco. There is three, this, these three kinds of, companies. That is legal in Morocco and they have the right as a legal companies to work in the tourism field to organize this kind of tours or activities or events in Morocco.

Otherwise, if someone told you that I am a travel company, there is now something called travel company. There is travel agency, there is travel tour operator, and there is a transportation company. That's it.

AZDEAN: yeah,

SIHAM: Some people are [00:45:00] worried to call themselves a travel agency because it's quite big. So they say a travel company, because a lot of people, if travelers don't know the difference.

It's quite similar, so they always expect, it's a travel agency while they are not really writing this, it's just a travel company. 

AZDEAN: I remember this person when we talked, she told me, look, I went with my friend and we paid $800 for a 10 day tour. and I was like, wow. So 80 bucks. She lives in the U S I mean, $80 in the U S including a driver, car and the driver, including, you know, transportation, including a stay. at a hotel, So When she finished, she was like, I paid $2,800 at the end of the tour. we now we,

SAM: remember, yeah,

AZDEAN: Yeah, going from 800 to $2800. She paid $2,000 more because you you want to go to Marjorelle[00:46:00] Garden?

It's $250. Okay, we dropped you off the tour finishes in Marrakech. You're flying out of Casablanca. Oh $200 per person. So what they do is they rent motor coaches. They rent a motor coach for a thousand dollars a day. That's the, that's the price for, a motor coach. So now they have 50 seats that they can fill at $200 a pop.

So they make $60,000 a day, a minimum, just for transportation. They paid $1,000. they're not going to pay any driver because the driver and the bus come same price. There's no gas. There's no expenses. There's no overhead. They're paying the company $1,000 and they're making arrivals and departures, a shuttle service between Casablanca and Marrakech because they pick you up from the airport in Casablanca.

They drop you off in Marrakech. Then when it's time for you to go, they pick you up from Marrakesh, then they take you to to Casablanca airport. And you know, you've been with them in a tour and say, they took advantage of me. But you know what? I don't wanna go with somebody else and scam me even more. I can [00:47:00] do $200.

I, I'll, I'll do it. I'll take it. You see what I'm saying? 

Sam You have anything else you wanna add to this subject, please?

SAM: Yeah, beside what, Siham mentioned before, in terms of day trips, and they called them, by the way, a name, a special name, shared group tours. What they're selling in the Jemaa el-Fnaa Square and around in the Old Medina, by the way, it's in the Old Medina of Marrakech and in Fez as well.

And this exists in Merzouga recently. this is the big scam. square. They just sell you Ouarzazate one day trip or one day excursion to Ouarzazate. And the description they gave you, "You will see the dunes and the desert and you will see camels and you will see..."

AZDEAN: How much and how much is it, by the way, Sam?

SAM: much is it? It's $20.

AZDEAN: Oh man.

SAM: Could you imagine? Oh, okay. By the way, taking a bus, a public transportation, public buses, we call them in [00:48:00] Morocco, or auto car in Morocco, we call them, to take them from Marrakech to Ouarzazate, one way. You pay 200, 200 dirhams, just one way,

AZDEAN: Okay.

SAM: $20 one way, just to go into public transportation.

So, what is about this local transportation? How, how it comes with $20 or with all this? even, even cheaper than a public transportation. Okay, as Siham mentioned, they give you just a ticket, just a piece of paper with how much you paid, your name, that's it. The departure, 7, for example, to Ouarzazate. They send you a car to pick up from your location. And they bring it to Jemma el-Fnaa Square. You get out of this car and You get into the other car. You have to wait there in the other car for one hour.

What imagine from 7 to 8, then you have to get out of this car and join another car, another, another minibus or minivan. [00:49:00] And you're still there, for example, 20 minutes and you say, Oh, sorry, not this car because this car has another thing. You have to move to the other car. Then you move to the other car from 7 to 9 or 9.

30. And sometimes you didn't have breakfast and didn't have anything and you have wait all this, all this time wasting your time until you get really upset. Then they give you a driver who is driving very fast and it's dangerous.

AZDEAN: hold on Sam, please. So why moving too much? are you waiting for somebody else to come? Are you for waiting for, for everybody to, to, to gather up?

SAM: Yeah, sometimes, sometimes just because they are not organized. There is, as I mentioned, there is fake, fake panels or fake signs everywhere. And this one sells the tour at eight and this one at seven and this one at nine. For the same day trip and they have to gather to gather people then sometimes when they don't have [00:50:00] like, many bus, 17 seats, for example, They still have, three left. They should. Wait for another scammer, somewhere, to bring them, the three guests, in order

SIHAM: the minibus

SAM: get the minibus full, to start the day trip. 

SIHAM: it's, your luck how people would, 

SAM: yeah, it's painful. It's painful.

SIHAM: by the way, I just want to make it more clear, for those type of trips, there is no organization, by the way, there is no one organizing the trip. All the thing is a trick. It's a game between many, many, many, many people together. So these people are not a travel agency around.

These are, I call them sellers. They are selling wherever they want. They can say you whatever they want. Lies, stories, whatever. Sell you, that's their mission. It's finished, it's done. They won't care about where you are, which hotel, what's the meal. All it's done by taking [00:51:00] money, bye bye. They're already working with somebody else.

AZDEAN: I totally agree. . So we're getting close to the end. So Siham, anything that you want to add. or any questions that I should have asked you and I forgot to ask you, please.

SIHAM: Yeah. Thank you 

I just remember the funny story about the trip the famous trip I did to the desert some of the clients They were asking about their luggage. So we went to the camp on the camels. So what happened with the luggage? It was on the minibus that we never go to the camp on the camel.

So the guys of the camp suggested and proposed their services as they have a jeep there or a 4x4 car that can cross the dunes. And said, yes, of course we can take your luggage, but you have to pay at 20. Per person.

SAM: Oh my god.

SIHAM: So they're paying like $50 for the trip for three days, and they have to pay a $20 , which is the [00:52:00] third of the cost to get their luggage from the mini bus to the camp.

AZDEAN: Ah,

SIHAM: or otherwise they're gonna sleep in.

It's very cold in the night, right there with no clothes. And then the total night, it was like I told you before it was like five hours.

included the sleep, you know, including the dinner and the sleep. And in the very early morning, like, wake up, wake up, wake up, we're gonna miss the sun, the sunrise.

Go, go, go! Sunrise, then okay, the van, please go! The driver is stressed about the time, and we got in the van. It was a total, I swear, of 14 hours drive. I've never been on that long.

SAM: Yes.

SIHAM: 14 hours to be in Marrakech. So, Please be careful.

That's the last thing I want to say. Please be careful. If you're coming to Morocco, of course, you want to experience the best of it. The best of it is definitely none of these agencies. Please, if you're buying any tour, just ask this question. You're gonna get to know, Please give me your official [00:53:00] informations. They don't have any official

and even a number they don't have even a name they have just ask Yeah, please give me your license. Give me your professional matriculation, they don't have any of this. 

AZDEAN: Yeah. Yeah.

SIHAM: pay and, take the van, then it's done, the story is done.

You're with another person that don't know about any of the promises that you've got with the first, in the agency. Oh god.

AZDEAN: Sam, any last words,

SAM: Yes, I would just to finish with a story. I remember one of the drivers working in the, those group tours on the square, on the Jemma el-Fnaa Square, told me once that's, he went on a tour to Merzouga and he doesn't speak, by the way, any word of English. And there is two ladies, they want to pee, and they ask him in English, Please stop, we need to use a restroom, we need to use a toilet. He didn't [00:54:00] understand. At once, he just stopped for a while, I think, He wants he wanted to smoke, or stuff like that, And they get out of, of the van, running outside, To the, to the, a real area, just, just having to pee! It's unbelievable. No,

SIHAM: yeah.

AZDEAN: Okay. Thank you, Sam.

SIHAM: It's not a joke, very, it's a really, really bad

AZDEAN: no. 

SAM: A real story, it's not a joke.

AZDEAN: please forgive me. I don't mean to laugh as a joke, as a joke, but I know it's serious. It's just, it's just really sad. and very unfortunate. 

SAM: yeah, to pay your money and you didn't get an equivalence, the good service, or just a good driver who is respecting the rules while driving or just speaks at least one word of language, it hurts.

AZDEAN: Yeah. Yeah. And again, when you're traveling tomorrow, Morocco is a beautiful country. We've talked about this and you know, the love that we have for Morocco, the passion that we have for Morocco, you can [00:55:00] sense it in our voices. If you're listening to us on a podcast, you can see it in our eyes. If you see us on social media or YouTube.

we love Morocco. We are all the same. We are ambassadors to Morocco. And you mean a lot to us when you go and visit Morocco. We want to give a good image about Morocco.

And there's a lot of. Amazing people that do an outstanding job, more in Morocco, inside and outside. and we're doing the best that we can here. , you know, between us, we're talking seven, eight decades of, you know, tourism industry and hospitality.

So we really, really care. and, and the funny part, we talk about scams and, and sometimes we are being scammed as well. but when it happens to you, just just be very careful. If looking for cheap stuff, traveling to Morocco is an investment, protect your investment, you know, 

SIHAM: and you deserve, to experience the best of it. Why would you just decide to get it that

way? 

AZDEAN: And yeah. So, in today's session you know, I'm very grateful for your time, that you have spent with us, Siham and Sam, and [00:56:00] and thank you for being such a good guest and I'm very grateful for you, and I cannot really, really thank you enough.

so this is part two of the most dangerous scams in Morocco and we'll, we'll come back again, for more episodes dedicated just to scam. Obviously, like we said in the past, we cannot really cover all of them. But we'll do our best and give you examples and stories. hopefully, it'll help you along the way to your journey in Morocco.

Thank you so much and have a wonderful 

SIHAM: you so much.

SAM: Absolutely, thank you very much, it's a pleasure, a big pleasure.