Transcript
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Welcome to the Destination Morocco podcast, the show that takes you away to the beautiful country of Morocco.
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I am your host, Azdean Elmoustaquim.
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In each episode, we explore Moroccan culture, history, attractions and activities real and practical information coming from experienced travelers and native Moroccans like myself.
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And now let's go exploring.
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Welcome back to another incredible episode of Destination Morocco podcast, and in this episode we have a special guest.
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As always, it's always amazing to have you, Ted the producer, with us.
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In today's episode, we're going to be discussing who is interested in Morocco and why so, Ted.
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Welcome back to the show.
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Thanks very much.
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It's always fun to be here.
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This episode, this question I guess I was thinking about it a little while ago what makes people interested in any place?
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I suppose in general, but in Morocco specifically, we talk about a lot in this show.
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You've brought up how it's a different place.
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It's not every country is distinct, for sure, but Morocco kind of stands out just by nature of what it is.
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It's in Africa but it's so close to Europe.
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It has all these different influences and a real mix of cultures and religion and background and all that and languages and on and on, and I don't know if there's other countries that really have that exact same mix and that makes it distinct.
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And so it got me thinking well, are people aware of that?
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What gets them interested in Morocco in the first place?
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What are their perceptions maybe, or assumptions about it?
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Things you hear about perhaps in the media, culture, movies, things like that.
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And that presents an opportunity for you to talk about some of the questions that you've heard over the years, just people you've talked to your clients, for sure, and what their initial impressions or thoughts about Morocco were, and then maybe how that changed and evolved, of course, once they actually went and experienced it for themselves.
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So really, that's it, in your experience, what makes Morocco appealing.
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What kind of questions do you get?
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Well, what makes Morocco appealing, besides the location, is the people, the Moroccan people.
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The location is incredible because it's in Africa, so there's a lot of African influence, then there's North Africa, which are Arab speaking countries, then there's Middle East obviously the connection and then there's Europe.
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So it's a combination, it's a very unique combination that Morocco has and that's what really creates that appeal.
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And you can see that appeal in the European side, or European countries, or visitors and tourists, versus the others, especially if we're talking North America, usa, for example, canada and stuff like that.
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And probably that has to do with, maybe, the distance.
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Morocco is not as popular in North America versus Europe because it's just too far and people now are discovering it in the recent years, especially the last couple of years.
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Have you really seen that change in the recent couple?
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of years.
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Yes, absolutely, and it really started with the World Cup, obviously, then the men's World Cup, then the women's World Cup, then Morocco hosting the World Cup, then another soccer event in 2029 and another soccer event in 2025.
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So it got a lot of attention.
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Then, unfortunately, with the earthquake, it made people ask a lot of questions Morocco where is Morocco?
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People did not know that Morocco is in Africa, and many other questions.
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But there's definitely change in the perception, how people see Morocco.
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for sure, Do you find when people you meet, people ask you questions.
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Are they very familiar with Morocco?
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Are they like I don't know anything about it, or do they kind of have some idea?
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It really depends.
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For people that travel, they have an idea.
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For people that don't really travel, they have no clue.
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Morocco, they always confuse it with Morocco.
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It's like when I say I'm from Morocco, I was like what are you doing here?
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They think I came from Morocco.
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I was like, no, no, I came from Africa.
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Not that part of it Interesting.
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I remember when I first came to the US this is back in 1995, I used to work at a Mexican restaurant, just a bus boy and a waiter, and I remember people asking because everybody's from Mexico, colombia, venezuela, salvador and say hey, where are you from?
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Because I look a little different.
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And I say Morocco is like okay, say Maruecos, oh, maruecos.
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They say okay, can you do the dance?
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And it's like what dance?
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Because they look at the African dance that I think Africa is one country.
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They say no, no, we don't do that dance in Morocco, we have our own dances.
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So it's just funny how people randomly and again this was almost 30 years ago somebody was asking me in Morocco and I was like oh, yeah, oh, I know where it is.
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Then I said yeah, where is it?
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They said it's next to India.
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So people, really a lot of people don't know.
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They just don't know.
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So that's what makes travel really, really important in our lives.
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I mean, it changes you, it makes you a better person, it makes you connect better with other cultures and other people.
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So I remember those questions very vividly.
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Even now.
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A lot of people are familiar because of the travel, because of the media, because of the TV and all the movies that they have been made in Morocco.
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But there's still a little bit of perception, a little bit of expectation, of what Morocco is versus what they have in their minds.
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Well then, that's a good question, because I suppose those expectations or perceptions will only ever change once you go, once you actually experience it in person.
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So do you have any stories or anything that comes to mind of maybe clients and your tours?
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And they came back home presumably the United States and, yeah, they said, well, it wasn't what I expected, or it was a lot different, or just do you remember any of those kind of anecdotes of how people change?
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There's actually a lot of those stories, but the one that really stands out and I've spoken about it quite a few times is Max.
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You know people, when they travel to Morocco they ask a lot of the good questions.
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They ask the right questions and it's always out of respect before they want to go tomorrow.
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They don't want to offend anyone, they don't want to be culturally wrong with a lot of things.
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So they ask what to wear, what to pack, what to do and how to act and stuff like that.
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So what to wear always comes up.
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So when Max went to Morocco and she had somebody pick her up from the airport and that girl that picked her up from the airport was wearing a very, very short skirt and she was shocked and that was her first impression of Morocco.
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Like, oh my God, I would not let my daughter wear that stuff.
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And this lady in Morocco, in Africa, is coming to pick me up from the airport.
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So Morocco is a very open country and it's good that a lot of people ask those questions because they really care and it's really really important to care.
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So when you go, a lot of the perceptions they change after you experience Morocco.
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For sure, yeah, is that a combination of things?
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It's the people, but it's also the landscape, it's the influence of all those different things, because when you're out there in the desert, it's amazing, it's so stunning and it's something you never forget.
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But you know, there's a people too.
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There's the music and the culture, and just I would say it's a combination of everything that you have said, because the landscape changes.
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Every 45 minutes you have a different landscape.
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So to a lot of people that's a really surprise, but for the people that live in Morocco they can't see the difference.
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It's just normal to them, obviously.
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Then the other thing is it's the people.
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You know they treat you, they talk to you, they welcome you into their houses, their villages, whatever it is.
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You know you're in the north side, the south side, then the beauty of the mountains you have, you know, the big Atlas Mountains, the anti-Atlas Mountains.
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In the north side you have the Rift Mountains, and the Rift Mountains are completely different.
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They don't even look like they fit in Morocco.
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I mean it's just incredible.
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Then the culture, different cultures.
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I mean it's Morocco, but it's extremely diverse.
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The people in the north, then the people in the south, the languages they speak, the dialect that they speak it's just beautiful.
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The other thing is a lot of people they don't think Morocco is as big as it is.
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So when they start driving, whether in the north side or the south side, it's like I did not think Morocco is this big.
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So what do you see?
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The map that you see on the globe?
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It's incorrect.
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So Morocco is pretty big.
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There's quite a bit of driving distance from city to city, most of them, but also, again, there's so much stuff to see along the way.
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And it's worth pointing out.
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People may not or may have their assumptions, but there's expressways.
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I mean it's not just all winding roads.
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You can absolutely.
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Usually, when you drive from Fez to Marrakesh, you're going down past Rabat, casablanca, it's all expressway, so you know you can go fast.
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You can certainly take the other way around, which a lot of your tours do, which is more scenic in the smaller villages and the valleys and gorges, which is great, takes a lot longer, but it's.
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I mean, it comes back to these perceptions.
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You know, does Morocco have that kind of infrastructure?
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And of course it does.
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Yeah, when you look at, for example, from Fez to Marrakesh, you're looking at, for example, six hours in the highway, obviously there's stops, for sure.
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But then the other route that you can take, which you have mentioned, which is they call it the National Route, which is just, it takes about nine hours, it's very scenic and it takes a long time for many reasons and, again, there's so many stops along the way and you really, really enjoy it.
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So, for people who don't have the issue of time, they can do that, they can take that, you know, through the Atlas Mountains, yes, and enjoy the view, because it's beautiful, beautiful.
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Do you find that when people, I suppose, start the process, reach out to you, they have an idea already usually of what they want to see and where they want to go, or are they asking you for ideas?
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I would say now they really know because of the podcast and because they have listened to quite a few episodes.
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So they know exactly what they want to do.
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They know exactly what they want to see and they have their homework so they pick out everything from the activities to the type of royals they want to stay from.
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You know the cities they want to visit, for how long they want to stay in each city.
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Then we still have a small percentage.
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They just want you to book everything for them.
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So we make recommendations, we make suggestions and that's how we really do it.
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Is there a typical demographic who books your tours?
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Who's interested in going to Morocco?
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Really in general, Is it kind of a thing for all ages or do you find it's a certain type of person?
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It's very different and I'm glad you asked this question because a few weeks ago I was trying to, you know, to work on some stuff for us internally to understand and build a personal brand.
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So we do see, you know, for example, I have the notes in front of me, the client persona, and I have them actually by names, the guests that we had in the past.
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For example, I call it adventurous Rachel.
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You know anybody who's in their 30s and 40s.
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They're solo, you know, very passionate.
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They want to immerse themselves in the local experience.
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Then we have, for example, family focused, like Roxanne, you know, she's from Canada.
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Age group is between 45 to 55 years old.
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They have teenager kids, adult kids and they just want to have that family bond with the kids.
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Then we have the luxury seeking I call it luxury seeking Lauren, which she was in Morocco last month with us, and basically they just want everything to be taken care of and catered to them.
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They want top notch and that's that's what we call it luxury seeking Lauren.
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Then we have the history buff and we named it history buff Ray because it was Ray and his wife Sharon, and they're, you know, between 50s and 60s.
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They are retired.
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They love exploring the historical sites of Morocco and such.
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So we don't really serve just one type of audience.
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Then also we have the honeymooners and we have Tessa actually, tessa, she's living in the US today and she's going to get to Morocco tomorrow and we call the honeymooners.
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They are young couple celebrating the love and we plan in an incredible Morocco itinerary for them, full of surprises.
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So I don't want to give away a lot of information because you might be listening.
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We'll hear about it later.
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Yeah for sure.
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Yes, and really that's the type of audience that we have.
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We don't have one size fits all, but everything we do is really customizable.
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Everything we do is to the guests in their terms, basically.
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So yeah, do you find, like, at least the people they reach out to you that you talk with like are they looking for something a little different?
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That's not the cookie cutter type thing is probably where they come to you in the first.
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Oh, 100%.
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Maybe they want the cultural stuff, maybe they want to have more time to explore whatever, and they're not interested in the big, big group tours and things like when you go with us.
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These are the things that you see.
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It's like you said, it's not a cookie cutter, it's very different.
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So I'll give you an example.
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When Sasha went with us, she wanted specifically to spend more time in the desert and she had a life changing experience.
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This is exactly how she put it.
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We loved having her.
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It was amazing, amazing, building her itinerary.
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So we were very lucky to have her in the camp.
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When we had her with Saeed, which we did an episode with, and he just went above and beyond.
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Everybody that she came in contact with Was just amazing.
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She did much better than we did it.
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The funny thing we used to have the website long time ago and we had some I would say about 23 different itineraries that people can just choose from and say this is what I want and that's it.
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But now I mean, we have a new itinerary on the website.
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We have eight.
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We have eight, eight tours on the new website, but now nobody has ever said that's what I want.
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So everything we really do when it comes to private tours is built from scratch and it's 100% customizable.
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So we have done hundreds and hundreds of itineraries and I promise you that there's there's not one itinerary that.
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It's a copy paste of the other one.
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Everything is unique.
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Everything is unique.
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Yeah, so interesting, yeah, and how much does it change on the fly, like I?
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was thinking about this too, because I was looking at your tours, the like there's the eight standard tours and there's itineraries kind of sketched out, but even then, like, how much can still change in the moment, the day before and someone says, well, I'd rather do this, or that's been changed like, can you have that kind of flexibility?
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Yes, because we have to be flexible.
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We don't have a choice but to be flexible.
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But also want to mention sometimes being flexible Really cost us a little bit of money, but we don't pass any of that cost to the client and we never mentioned, we never talk about it, and we've been in this situation many times, but like we don't you know penny pinch clients we're not going to add this to them or charge me extra.
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No, whatever the cost, we just take care of it behind the seat and we don't even mention it.
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They said I want to cancel this, I don't want to do this, and it's done Because, again, everything is done on their terms, not ours.
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Yeah, so yeah, are there any?
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You've built so many of these itineraries now over the years, like are there any?
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Are there any that stand out?
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And anyone is listening has done this.
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You know, travel planning and just for yourself, and it's like sometimes you've got to put all these pieces together, and maybe it's transport and getting from here to there, and when things open and close, like, can you think of any moments that stood out where you're able to just really get something really nice and tight and it all came together and then the guest, of course, had a great time and like, can you remember some moments like that?
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Oh, so many, so many, so many.
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Shantel's case, when her daughter, she, she had an emergency and she had to go to the dentist, and that's when she really realized the things that we do behind the scene, all the type of work that goes behind the scene and and the clients don't get to see it.
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Sometimes we have medical emergencies and that changes literally everything.
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So we have to cater to the client and make sure that everything is done, taking care of and, again, accommodate them.
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So there's, there's really a lot, of, a lot of the stories I hear.
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Something I was wondering, like is there a difference?
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Have you found there's a difference between Europeans and Americans when it comes to Morocco, their perception of it, getting there, the notion of traveling, because it's obviously so much closer for them, europeans?
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So do you really see that there's different questions, different demands?
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Maybe people can do different things because they're that much closer.
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They could come back, you know, next year.
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Something is that much easier.
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Oh, definitely.
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I would say the Europeans compared into the United States, they're probably about 30 years ahead of the United States In terms of as far as travel to Morocco.
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Yes yes, because I remember, even as a kid, as a teenager, especially when we go to the mountains, I see a lot of Europeans, french and, I would say, the Germans.
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The Germans are very different when it comes to their trial.
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They're the best backpackers.
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You know, it's funny because the last tour that we did back in the summer, I was, I went to the mountains, so I was with my father and then, you know, obviously because we have a gate, and I opened the gate and there's just in front of the house, there's a couple camping in front of.
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It was just funny and I laughed so hard, but it's very comforting because they feel very safe.
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You know, I know we talked about safety and an episode or two ago and it's very, very comforting.
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Again, I met a German couple.
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This is back in 2012.
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I was in the middle of nowhere, in the middle of the mountains, and I saw these two bikers, you know, just passing by.
00:18:49.854 --> 00:18:50.974
I seen them from distance.
00:18:50.974 --> 00:18:56.067
They got closer and closer to me and then they approached me and they said hi and I said hello.
00:18:56.067 --> 00:19:06.586
I was so surprised that they spoke English and we talked maybe for 30 seconds or so and they were Germans, they love Morocco and they were biking.
00:19:06.586 --> 00:19:08.928
You know bicycles, backpacking.
00:19:08.928 --> 00:19:15.114
The Europeans, they know how to travel to Morocco definitely better when it comes to backpacking.
00:19:15.114 --> 00:19:20.880
They do more solo travel than organized travel, whether it's group or private tours.
00:19:20.880 --> 00:19:37.365
The US is just getting to figure out Morocco, to know Morocco, because, unfortunately, because of the distance and then because of the other destinations that are closer to the US I'm talking specifically to Mexico you know travel agents, a lot of people.
00:19:37.365 --> 00:19:41.880
They want they rather go to Mexico or Caribbean versus Ventura now all the way to Africa.
00:19:43.082 --> 00:19:44.585
And that's for the travel agents.
00:19:44.585 --> 00:19:46.989
I suppose that's what they know a lot more.
00:19:46.989 --> 00:19:47.931
They're much closer.
00:19:47.931 --> 00:19:48.612
That's what they sell.
00:19:48.612 --> 00:19:50.154
They're probably not as familiar with Morocco.
00:19:50.900 --> 00:19:52.201
Yeah, the travel agent.
00:19:52.201 --> 00:19:54.825
For me they're missing out on a lot of money.
00:19:54.825 --> 00:20:06.880
We all understand they work on commission, but the commission that they can make on trip to Morocco is, you know, they would make the same commission booking five trips to Mexico or cruise and stuff like that.
00:20:06.880 --> 00:20:11.615
But they don't know that most of a lot of travel agents.
00:20:11.615 --> 00:20:21.089
They have their own niche that they specialize in, whether it's Ocean cruise, river cruise, luxury groups, honeymoon weddings and stuff like that.
00:20:21.089 --> 00:20:23.756
But I wish they could include Africa as well.
00:20:23.756 --> 00:20:25.259
There's so many things to see in Africa.
00:20:25.259 --> 00:20:26.623
It's just a beautiful continent.
00:20:26.623 --> 00:20:28.272
Morocco is just.
00:20:28.272 --> 00:20:31.240
It's just incredible and amazing destination itself.
00:20:32.294 --> 00:20:41.935
You know, I was wondering, especially when we were there, but like, how much is African identity part of Moroccans native Moroccans, of course Like, do they feel African as much as anything?
00:20:41.935 --> 00:20:43.721
Oh, for sure 100%.
00:20:44.351 --> 00:20:48.938
This is something it's really difficult to explain, but we are beyond proud Africans.
00:20:48.938 --> 00:20:51.374
There's something that connects us.
00:20:51.374 --> 00:20:52.636
We bond together.
00:20:52.636 --> 00:20:53.941
It's beyond belief.
00:20:53.941 --> 00:21:01.433
This is, I don't think people feel it in the US and it's expected, it's perfectly fine, but there's All African countries.
00:21:01.433 --> 00:21:17.613
Anywhere I go, anywhere I travel, whether using any type of transportation or, you know, public transportation or millionaire convention, once somebody you talk to, where you're from Senegal, where you from South Africa, where you from Morocco, there's instant bond.
00:21:17.613 --> 00:21:20.278
There's an instant bond, instant trust.
